Book+12+-+Boomer+&+Me


 * Discussion Dates:** Friday 22nd November to Friday 6th December



1) What would you give this book out of 10? Why?

Jaime - Hmmmm... A confession. I didnt finish it. In fact I only read the first 50 pages or so and the book then stayed neglected in my bedside table. I have recently been doing some work with an autism foundation so was excited to read this book and imagining something along the lines of The Curious Incident Of The Dog In The Night. Instead I found the details of the narrators life.... well... boring. and maybe a little self absorbed. Perhaps if I was a Mum with an autistic child it would be just the salve I needed but for me it was just too mundane. Or maybe I needed to read the rest of the book?!

Genevieve: 5/10 I totally agree Jaime. I found it dull and skimmed the final part of the book. (However a dear friend of mine was reading this book soon after her daughter was diagnosed as autistic and she found it useful. Actually if anyone is interested she is writing a blog about her experiences raising a deaf and autistic child which is absolutely heart breaking but wonderful []).

Lucy: 3/10 I agree. I skipped a lot of the first part as I couldn't stand how self absorbed it all was. I wanted to shout at her to get off the sofa and make herself a decent meal and stop complaining. However, having found out later in the book that she has asperger's herself I have perhaps become a little more tolerant although I still find it annoying.

Mel: 5/10 At times I was interested in the very raw and human way that Case told her story, but yes, for the most part it was quite pedestrian. It did make me reflect however on how I parent my children, and made me think about the importance of spontaneity. Some of the stuff Case did with Leo was great - his t.shirts that he could draw all over/ getting soaking wet and freezing to get the star fish for him. But I bet that there are probably many aspects of my parental relationship with my kids that Case would like to emulate. It swings both ways.

Lynne: 6.5/10. I had expectations that this book was about a kid with Aspergers, so I found the first part (which focussed on Jo and other mundane parts of her life) quite incongruous. By the end I came to understand that this 'background' was included to explain more about //her// diagnosis than Leo's. As it wore on I enjoyed it a little bit more, but I never really engaged with the story, or the people. Too many inconsequential details like "then we had an ice cream"..or catch ups with her bookshop friends.

Sharyn: 6/10. Like Lynne, I expected the book to be focused on a boy's experience with Aspergers and therefore I found the stories about Jo's marriage and day to day life confusing and distracting. Once the story moved on to Leo's diagnosis I enjoyed it a lot better. I enjoyed reading a personal account of life with Aspergers and learning more about it. I agree with the reviewer who said something to the effect that 'the book would do a lot of good in the world' - I imagine that parents of children with Aspergers would read this book and take comfort from the fact that Leo was a great kid with a great family and a normal life.

Lara: 5/10. This is the first book that I've really had a hard time finishing. I will, but its certainly not keeping me up at night. That's why I'm coming to the discussion really late - I thought I would try and finish it and then comment, but didn't. Everyone's comments above are interesting as at least I'm not alone. I like learning more about a kid (and now Mom) with Aspergers, but the excessive self-reflection and mundane details made it tough. I do appreciate her honesty of feeling and I also think this book has a lot of merit for those trying to come to terms with an Aspergers diagnosis.

2) Is Boomer & Me more a story about Jo Case or about her son Leo? Or does it not really matter whom it is about?

Gen: It is mainly about Jo, I found the parts where she struggled with her own 'diagnosis' interesting and how she could see certain personality traits repeated throughout her family.

Lucy: It is much more about her. I think it would have been more interesting were it more focussed on Leo, but perhaps she is unable to do that.

Mel: It is about Jo Case. I personally don't think that this matters - although it would be frustrating for those who had bought it hoping for some insights into how to support/cope with a child who has Asperger's. In fact, compared to a couple of boys that I have come across in my teaching with Asperger's, Leo's behaviour and traits really don't seem all that difficult to cope with.

Gen: I agree Mel, I kept thinking that his behaviour was not that extreme (compared to other experiences I have heard about). It was great that he still had plenty of friends.

Lynne: Agree with Lucy, it's more about Jo. I reckon that was done in an effort to protect Leo in the future. It did matter to me because I don't really care about adults with Aspergers! I spent a lot of time thinking about the incidents that would occur each time Leo went to play at some kids house. I wondered how Leo coped after these episodes and felt really sorry for him. The tantrums at Auskick sounded awful. Imagine an 8 year old boy bawling so much he was unable to continue. Such a big kid to be breaking apart like that - so sad. I wish the book was more about Leo.

3) Do blogs make good books?

Jaime - I have recently become more of a consumer of blogs and am loving them. I really don't think they make good books. I think almost anyone can write a decent blog but the weaving of storyline and use of language in a truly wonderful book is the gift of few.

Gen- I agree Jaime, I am not sure that blogs make good books. I can see how this story as a blog that you followed little bits at a time could be interesting but all together in a book became boring and repetitive.

Lucy: I have not read any blogs but do not think that it has worked well in this case turning a blog into a book.

Lynne: I confess that I have not read a blog either. I wouldn't even know where to look, or why. Am I too old? Anyway, if this is a blog turned into a book, then I found the daily commentary on her life dull.

4) At one stage in the book, Tony says (pg 186) "I think reading too much about this [Asperger's] makes you think you have it". Do you agree?

Gen- I guess because Autism is a 'spectrum' disorder then we all fall somewhere on that 'spectrum' which is why it is easy to think that you or people you know have some of the personality traits.

Lucy: I think it depends on your frame of mind. I am sure for some people reading too much about any disorder would make them feel they have it.

Lynne: I agree with Tony, the more you read about things (particularly when forming an internet diagnosis) the more you identify with them. In Jo's case (mind the pun) I think she //wanted// to identify with the symptons so she could categorise her behaviour and find a method of dealing with it.

5) Do you think that the characteristics of Asperger's are too broad (or the spectrum so wide) so as to pass judgment on any behavior or characteristics, which are 'left of center'?

jaime - I have been told that 1 in 4 boys in Australia are thought to be on the spectrum. This worries me because I think if a disorder is that prevalent we may be medicalizing the great diversity in personalities and a right to individuality that makes the world so interesting

Gen- because of my friend's recent experience of having a child diagnosed with autism I have been learing more about it. It seems to me that the characteristics are pretty specific and the testing rigorous so it is not a term that professionals in this field would just casually apply. However as a teacher I certainly hear plenty of casual (and potentially uninformed) observations along the lines of 'I reckon so and so is on the spectrum'.

Lucy: I think this relates to the previous question. I am sure we can all recognise some traits in people we know but I guess it is the combination of many of them that leads to a proper diagnosis.

Mel: Gen - I totally agree. Teachers throw 'on the spectrum' around with abandon. And this is dangerous. I have been at hand over meetings from say Grade 6 to Grade 7 where the Grade 6 teachers go through their class list and tell the Gr 7 teachers what they think that they should know about the students for the next year. I have heard teachers say, "we/I strongly suspect that so and so is on the spectrum". No assessments have been done, nothing - just a teachers hunch. And that stays in the mind of the Gr 7 teachers and I have heard Gr 7 teachers the next year go on and tell the same thing to the Gr 8 teachers. This should never happen.

Sharyn: Jaimie, I couldn't agree more. No doubt there is a medical reason why the spectrum is so broad but from my perspective as a layperson (not a medical professional) I query why is it necessary to 'label' people who have certain characteristics in circumstances where their behaviour is not extreme or a danger to themselves or others. If a kid like Leo is on the spectrum, then half the boys I went to primary school with were on the spectrum! I didn't think that Leo's behaviour was extreme and I am kind of disturbed by the fact that someone like him is on the spectrum. I am also disturbed about what Mel and Gen are saying about teachers throwing the Aspergers label around - that's terrible!

6) Do you see any of your own idiosyncrasies/habits/flaws/gifts as inherited from your parents, or, if you have children do you see any of these reflected in them? If so, what are they?

Gen- of course all the time! All the good is me, all the bad is my husband....

Lucy: I can recognise how I am like my mum in some ways but not in nearly as many ways as my siblings accuse me of! Sorry mum, they do of course always mean it in a very complementary way.

Mel: There are little things that my mum thinks and says and does that I find myself replicating, but they are small issues. But maybe I am too close to the situation. Interestingly (considering that he is adopted) I see a lot of both Ben's mum and dad in him. Always wanting to solve a problem rather than just listening to problems, (overly) worrying about our kids safety, caring for the environment, loving animals etc.. Nurture rather than nature in this situation. As for the kids... Jack is very polite and always uses and remembers people's names - this is important to Ben and I and we model it constantly to him - so is that more taught than inherited? Probably. He is also quite emotional (Ben) and stubborn (me).

Lynne: I can see my father reflected in my eldest brother to such a large degree that it disturbs me. I think when I look at my own kids that they change/mature so rapidly that it is too early to tell who they may take after but there are some early signs that our youngest is as quirky as her dad.

Sharyn: I can see aspects of both my mum and dad in my personality and behaviour, particularly my dad as I have inherited his temperament and emotional nature. My initial reaction was that I cannot see any of my personality (or my husband's personality) in our son. However, my husband has just pointed out to me that he shares some of our traits: he is earnest (me), curious (me), shy (my husband) but generally pretty happy go lucky (my husband). Given how much time I have spent with him, I am amazed (and pleased) that he hasn't picked up some of my less flattering traits, such as my temper!

7) What makes a person want to tell a deeply personal story to a wide audience?

Jaime - lots of different reasons I think: it's cathartic; to help others in the same situ;

Genevieve- I think raising a child with particular needs can be a very lonely road so blogs in particular are a way of connecting with other people about your experiences

Lucy: I think it depends on the nature of the story as to the nature of the reason for telling it. I agree with Gen in this case that it is a huge support to connect with others who may be in a similar position or be able to get feedback and acceptance from people you don't know. I'm not sure I would ever want to do it.

Mel: I would never write a book like this. Case's public flogging of people like Leo's teacher and her old school mate bother me. We don't get to hear their story or their perspective. What is known about them in the public domain is what she has written about them. While some characteristics of my personality are extroverted, I am also quite private and respectful of those around me. I would just never speak ill of my parents on any level, for instance, in a public forum. Cathartic maybe, but also a bit selfish. What about Leo? I know that due to social media privacy is not what it used to be - but what about when he wants to get a job or a girlfriend - there it is in print that he used to always pull his pants down. How is this helpful to his future self?

Gen: Good point Mel this definitely bothered me too, particularly as many many people would be able to work out exactly who she was talking about at Yarraville primary school!

Lynne: I'm not sure what compels some people to be talkers and some to be listeners, but I could never reveal so much of myself and my son (particularly if he was having difficulties socialising). If she has done this in an effort to educate others about life with 2 Asperger-y people in one family, then she failed. I learned very little from this tale.

Sharyn: From time to time I contemplate writing about certain personal situations I have encountered (not a book but say a newspaper article), mainly to highlight an issue or because I think there would be other people out there dealing with the same issues who might find it helpful or comforting. However, for privacy reasons I don't think I would be brave enough to do it under my real name. One of my oldest friends recently alerted me to her blog. It has quite a following and she even receives money from businesses who want her to mention their products. I read the blog and it was a lot about the time she suffered from post natal depression, something she had never told me about. I was surprised that someone who was usually so private would be so open on the internet. I felt awkward reading the blog and stopped reading it almost immediately.

8) Is there anything else about the book that you would like to say or ask?

Lucy: Gen, it is interesting to hear that your friend found it useful. From a teaching point of view having worked with children on the spectrum I don't think it has helped me at all with how to deal with their way of thinking and behaving.

Mel: Oh dear. I feel that I have wasted my book choice! When I go to Melbourne I am always compelled to buy some Australian books as I know that I won't see them on the book shelf in Singapore. To make my book club choices I chose 3 books that were sitting on my book shelf waiting to be read. In Melbourne, in July, I bought this book - Boomer and Me, Past the Shallows (one of the other books I nominated), Night Games (about sexual harassment in Aussie Rules footy - so didn't think appropriate to nominate as not interesting to those non-Aussies) and High Sobriety (about how totally out of hand Aussie drinking culture is - again I didn't think appropriate to nominate). I had actually read a very good review of Boomer & Me, and it was being promoted at the book shop and I am always keen to support new Australian authors. After nominating it, I flicked through it and thought "I hope it doesn't get chosen" and voted to something else (Beautiful Ruins). And of course it did get chosen. And it was average. And there isn't a lot to say about it. And now I feel annoyed to myself. Especially seeing as though I think that the other two books would have been good. I joked to Gen that I was going to nominate the Kofi Annan memoirs that I have to read for one of my classes at school. Why did I just joke about it? Why didn't I do it? I'm sure Annan's memoirs are going to be great! Anyway - that is my explanation and apology.

Gen: You do such a wonderful job with this bookclub don't you DARE apologise for ANYTHING! The whole point is that we read books we normally wouldn't. It is actually really hard I think for any bookclub to find a book that generates heated discussions, normally everyone generally agrees it was either good or bad. But I am really enjoying being a part of it.

Michelle: I agree with Gen!

Lynne: Why oh why did Jo include that whole trip to Mexico and their cheap dinners and Tony teaching her how to dive etc etc? I can't see how it was in any way relevant other than to show that she left Leo for a period of time and had her 1st trip overseas. Spare me. Mel, you didn't waste your choice. Bookclub is meant to push us out of our comfort zone and I for one am glad I read it.

Mel: Yes Lynna - that whole trip to Mexico was just so boring and pointless.

Sharyn: I thought it was interesting that girls and boy demonstrate Aspergers characteristics in different ways - I didn't know that.


 * Other questions **

9) When selecting books to nominate should we choose books that are likely to appear in libraries (both in Australia and in other countries) or are people happy to purchase books off Book Depository and other sites?

Jaime - Book depository is fine for me.

Mel: Book depository no problem. I only like to read books if I own them. Weird - yes. Expensive - yes. It's my thing.

Gen- and only hard back Mel! Either fine with me.

Lucy: I like the thought of libraries from a recycling/using less stuff point of view but I use a kindle for book club books anyway.

Michelle: I love my local library so that would be my preference - however, I might try downloading one next time. I've run out of space on my bookshelf and have decided I'm only buying books that are wonderful and/or beautiful.

Lynne: I like to borrow but am happy to buy off the internet too.

Jane: Would prefer to buy. I like to own em.

Amy: My preference is the local library but am happy to purchase books off Book Depository etc when necessary.

Sharyn: I also like to borrow but am happy to buy the book as well.

Lara: I've been buying them mainly on Kindle and they had Boomer & Me, so I don't see it as an issue.

10) What was your favourite book club book this year? Why?

Mel: I enjoyed All That I Am the most, but it is Lean In that I have thought about the most and talked about the most.

gen: All that I Am.

Lucy: Same as Mel and gen

Michelle: Lean In. I wanted to read it but never would have without the book club. I borrowed it from the library twice and never finished it but it gave me a lot to think about. I also liked the Woman Upstairs and the Glass Castle. These three books together are some kind of female trilogy!

Jane: The Glass Castle probably.

Lynne: I loved The Hare with Amber Eyes. It's the Japanophile in me.

Mel: The Hare with Amber Eyes was 2012 - but yes, I think that if we are talking about favourite book club books full stop - then the Amber Eyes would get my nod too.

Amy: Enjoyed the Glass Castle most and have passed it on a few times. Lean In I've thought about and discussed most.

Sharyn: Mornings in Jenin is the book that has stayed with me the most. I also loved our discussion about Lean In.

Lara: I was surprised with how much I enjoyed The Glass Castle. My Dad even read it after I talked to him about it. For Book Club discussion though, it was hard to beat Lean In with this group of women.

11) Which book(s) are you hoping to find under the Christmas tree this year?

Jaime - The Goldfinch - because the Secret History is one of my favourite books of all time and this book promises to be just as compelling... Can't wait!!

Mel: Me too Jaime. Really looking forward to The Goldfinch. In fact, it is very possible that you gave me The Secret History, which I too loved.

Lucy: I haven't thought about it much but Ian is very good at researching and finding books that I always enjoy.

Michelle: Just googled The Goldfinch! Sounds great!

Lynne: "In Cold Blood" by Truman Capote. I read it last year and it left such an impression on me that I must own it. A fascinating study on crime and early criminal psychology, told so beautifully it makes you weep.

Mel: Have always wondered about "In Cold Blood". Now I know that I need to read it. And this is why I love book club!

Jane: Just bought The Goldfinch supposedly for a Christmas present, but I might have to read it first. Can one do this? Is this ethical? I also want to read the new Tim Winton, and also The Luminaries because I am a patriotic Kiwi lass. I am also in the middle of reading Oliver Twist because I have been on a Dickens marathon - and it is genius and funny and sad and I wish Dickens were alive so he could join our book club.

Amy: Not nearly as interesting as any of the above books but reflective of where I'm at at the moment; Finding Your Element by Ken Robinson.

Mel: I love everything by Richard Flanagan. His book "Wanting" is a favourite of mine. Jane, if you are knee deep in Dickens this might be an interesting side read for you: http://www.theguardian.com/books/2009/sep/26/wanting-richard-flanagan-book-review

Jane: Thanks, Mel. FASCINATING. Wanting looks amazing.

Jane: One more thing... if you ladies love beautiful (albeit pricey) books, take a look at http://www.foliosociety.com/ I have bought many a book from Folio and they are STUNNING. They produce plenty of classics, plenty of fiction, plenty of art books, plenty of kids books, all with beautiful illustrations by topnotch artists. Most come in slip cases. I even get excited about the smell of the paper they are printed on.

Sharyn: I have a few books on my Christmas list: Unreliable Memoirs, The True History of the Kelly Gang, The Burgess Boys and The Luminaries. I also would like a book called The Art of Interviewing because I harbour a secret fantasy of being able to interview famous people for living (unlikely to happen, unfortunately).

Lara: Jane - go for it - if your friend is a book lover, they will understand! I loved "The Secret History", but didn't read Tartt's second book (did any of you?) - the Goldfinch looks really good. I also have seldom been as impressed with a TED talk as I was with Ken Robinson's. He is so funny in addition to being bright and spreading a very important message. I may have to check out the Element books. Also, I'll probably end up reading the new Malcolm Gladwell book on underdogs as his books are always quick reads that at least make you think. I also am interested in the David Goleman books after seeing him on Jon Stewart's "Daily Show" (Emotional Intelligence, Social Intelligence and Focus). Finally, one of my friends just finished "The Reason I Jump" and said it completely changed how he viewed Autism and that he highly recommends it, so that's on the list too. I just need the time to read now! Happy Holidays.

Jane: Thank you, Lara, for your advice on my conundrum. The book is now wrapped up, but it is still calling to me from beneath the paper. I loved The Secret History. I did not read The Little Friend. I would like to read Malcolm Gladwell's new book too. He is always a good time. I like his hair too.